We Won
I'm going to start this post by saying I'm a believer in Godesky. I find his posts thoughtful and well-researched. When challenged on things, he will look for more evidence to back up his claims or modify what he's said appropriately. All of this means that when he states that he believes we reached the peak of our civilization around 50-100 years ago, I listen.
I've been looking at the culture around us and I agree. I can't help but seeing the man-on-the-street arguments of "gee it seems to be getting hot" to be very similar to the old Mayan arguments of "gee I hope it rains soon." (fyi for those not in the know -- Mayan civilization wiped out by drought) There's also this constant re-assurance by the elite that everything will get better someday, somehow and that these 'things' run in cycles. It's all cyclical. It'll all be okay... no really. Sh*t. Um. Really, we'll save you any day now.
Sure you will, Mr. & Mrs. Elite. Sure...
This last week, an understanding hit me like the proverbial rock to the head. Something which changes the nature of what we -- as changed minds -- do.
We won.
At the height of its power, at the height of its energy, civilization could not crush all the Leaver cultures. It could not convert all of them -- as it did with the Caucasians -- to its inexorable path. Taoism, an animist way of life, even adapted into it, like a parasite masking its presence within its host. Even we people raised in this culture -- those of us whose link to our deepest ancestors was deliberately severed -- are working our way back to our roots.
This civilization is dead. It's done. At its height, it couldn't do what it promised it could do and now, it dies and, as with many dying things, vomits up poison and bile and plague and dangerous things. Different parts of it will grind to a halt, maybe soon maybe centuries from now. But once it's gone, we will be the only ones left.
Maybe not you and I -- we are still in the beast's insides as it shudders with gasping last breaths. But those of us who belong to the earth, who understand that fundamental truth, we will be all that is left.
I can hear some people now say "But what if civilization poisons the planet? What if climate change becomes too severe?" Well, then we die -- just the same as if a supervolcano goes up or an asteroid strikes or velociraptors return. 
It's no use fearing something that could come at us sideways, anyways, all ways. When our time is up as a species, it will be up.
But what does that mean for us right now? What does that mean for us working to 'change minds' or trying to change our own way of living?
Take a lesson from the scavengers of the dead. Be careful in your steps because the way is dangerous but be bold. Take what you need from your surroundings and make it into something new. Create beauty. Join up with others of like minds. Form communities. Form chains of different communities. Seek allies. When threatened, scatter, then return. Be persistent. Be creative. And most of all remember that this is your time, no matter what you might hear or what might happen to you. The Beast has died. Your time has come.
Best
Bill Maxwell
Always...
Submitted by Truly on Mon, 2007-11-26 06:35.
Those of us who are in the academic community are crazy. Crazy but not too crazy just yet, while most of us (who I know) who track this sort of thing say that there is something wrong, we generally wont say "civ is dead", mostly because there are too many factors involved.
I agree with Jason that -this- style of civilization that runs on cheap energy beyond its normal means will not come again, but i'm also not willing to suggest that civ itself is dead. After this civ is done, we will be talked about in legends, both in fearful and awed tones. Our age will be a golden age; a touched people living a charmed life.
Who wouldn't want to live up to that?
I think that after the long, dark, winter of ecological renewal, that if any memory or legend of us remains, people will try and start again. This is something that we really cannot control either, since it could be one thousand to two thousand years in the future, even the best laid plans go astray after a period of time. Check out the shit that Christianity has to deal with. I bet those original churches are collectively rolling in their graves.
I suppose my point here is not to simply nay-say, but also to bring the focus back to where I think I should rightfully be: the present. We need to focus on bringing back our local communities and finding ways to by-pass the all powerful market. If you already have, help others or bring people into your community; its like another nail in the coffin, a form of insurance against future unpleasentness.
So if you really believe Civ is dead, do as my friend Sped says and "always stab the dead guy."
Fun With Words :)
Submitted by TwoRoadsTom on Wed, 2007-12-26 05:37.
Ah, clarity. How I love that it comes to me in the early mornings...
All right, word fun. By "Civ", I am referring to the current phenomenon which runs 90+% of human culture at the moment and a sizeable chunk of our landly real estate. That would be what Quinn terms "Mother Culture" and our civilization born out of Sumeria 10,000 years ago.
In the premise, stated above, I do not believe that a world-girdling civilization -- or one that will come to dominate most of our real estate -- will rise again. First off, problems with cheap energy. Second off, tribes that will remember the f*ckupedness of the whole situation and keep some civs down.
However, I absolutely expect small scale civilizations to pop up again and try to spread (as they must do) but I doubt their grasp will last and to top that, I find the fact that the indigenous cultures survived the great big nasty apocalypse-bringind civilization to be a wonderful testament to the adaptability of humanity's collective spirit.
Regarding our current situation, scavenge the son-of-a-bitch to hell and gone; rip out its guts and use its organs. Take apart every piece you can to enhance life and diversity. In this way, if you, my friend, are right and civ is still alive, then it will help make it less so. And if I am right, it dissembles it faster.
Either way, positive outcome.
I think it was Jensen (but I'm not sure! Sorry!) who said there's no shame in using the master's tools to take apart the master's house.
Have fun!
Best
Bill Maxwell
Looking forward to Living L.A.
"Change comes from giving up the myth that you are in control."
The Others
Submitted by Truly on Wed, 2007-12-26 06:49.
What about all the other civlization experiments? Are they less evil because they were assimilated, destroyed, or died out before european civ came about? They had all the major halmarks of civ and would have spread if not for the other one coming along. It brings the same questions about: is any civ safe? I would think a big negatory on that one, but I might be wrong.
This is another example of the problems that I see from Jensen's public persona and the workings of more extreme anarchoprimativists: the focus is one destruction. The problem with this is well illistrated with Quinn's metaphor of the sinking ship. The goal is to get off the sinking ship of our culture and get to 'shore'. By destroying the ship and making it sink faster, is likely to mean that in the final lunge it simply takes you with it down to a cultural grave.
We need to focus on building the things we do not have before anybody even dreams about taking down civ, because if we don't have another cultural model to use we have nothing left. So the focus should be on building techniques for forming and maintaining community; working on working together.
Keep in mind that modern foraging peoples live in the worst places on earth, the places that agriculturalists wont touch. In these places, while life is still ok, its not at all like ancient hunters and gatherers. Quinn over players this card, suggesting that since tribes still exist, that tribes (often understood as hunter/gatherers) have gone through time without much change. They work so they survive. Since cultures are intimately tied to the environment they exist in, it would make sense that modern H/G tribalism is different from ancient pre-civ tribalism because both the ecology and political climate were different.
Damn, Bill...
Hey!
Wow. For someone that is too busy to think right now, you are on a serious roll, dude!
Good stuff.
But I couldn't help but think... some day there will be 'ancient legends' about "THE GODESKY"... just the way you phrased it there at the beginning. I can just imagine the look on Jason's face the first time he hears it
:D 
Janene